CNN host Lou Dobbs presented some big news on–wait for it–immigration last night (10/22/09):
New evidence that the American public wants action on the illegal immigration crisis in this country. A new CNN poll finds the vast majority of the American public wants illegal immigration stopped and most want illegal immigrants now in the country to leave–Lisa Sylvester with our report.
The CNN poll isodd; the main question is, “Would you like to see the number of illegal immigrants currently in this country increased, decreased, or remain the same?” 73 percent chose “decreased.” They asked a follow-up to find out if people want the numbers decreased “a little,” “a lot” or if they’d like to seem all of them removed immediately. Thirty-seven percent of the total sample chose the latter option; if that’s what Dobbs meant by “most” people, that’s just inaccurate reporting of his own network’s poll.
Dobbs’ reporter Lisa Sylvester uses the poll to make a bigger political point:
SYLVESTER: But Mark Krikorian with the Center for Immigration Studies, which favors tougher immigration law, says if anything, these polling numbers show that comprehensive immigration reform is going to be a tough sell.
MARK KRIKORIAN: Clearly, it’s not happening any time soon and these poll results really just underline that reality.
SYLVESTER: But President Obama still is insisting and committed to signing a comprehensive immigration bill.
The idea that responses to this poll reveal people’s feelings towards “reform” is a giant leap, since the CNN poll does not seem to have asked about that. Other polls have, though, like an April 9 ABC/Washington Post survey:
Would you support or oppose a program giving illegal immigrants now living in the United States the right to live here legally if they pay a fine and meet other requirements?
Support: 61 percent
Oppose: 31 percent
A CBS/New York Times poll (4/22-26/09)gave three options for dealing with undocumented immigrants:
Stay, Apply for Citizenship: 44 percent
Stay as Guest Workers: 21 percent
Leave: 30 percent
Since all three groups could describe themselves as wanting to see illegal immigration “decreased,” there’s no reason to believe that CNN‘s poll tells us much of anything about the immigration debate. It does, however, give Lou Dobbs something to talk about.
Contradicting the conventional wisdom:
Migrants Give More than They Take, Says UN
by Suzanne Hoeksema
Inter Press Service
http://www.commondreams.org/headline/2009/10/05-4
I have come to the conclusion that nobody really wants to solve the problem of illegal immigration. Least of all Lou Dobbs. They just want you to be affraid of people with brown skin.
If they really want to solve the problem here ar a couple of solutions that nobody is talking about. The first is quite simple the second a bit more complex but doable by a society that really wants to solve it.
Make the hiring of undocumented aliens a Class ‘A’ Felony. An employer caught hiring an undocumented worker would be subject to at least 1 year in prison and a minimum fine of $5000 per illegal hire. This would discourage the hiring of undocumented workers. It would reduce the jobs available to illegals. It would reduce the number of people who want to come here once they learn that there won’t be jobs for them. We must, also, actively put a stop to slavery in all forms here and abroad.
Renegotiate NAFTA and all current and future free trade agreements(FTA) to include allowing for collective bargaining, worker safety, minimum wage and environmental protections. It would go a long way toward improving the economies of our trading partners, providing jobs for the millions of workers fleeing their countries. It will also go a long way toward restoring the reputation of the United States for fairness and justice.
American workers are the most productive in the world. When they are allowed to compete on an equal economic field. By providing for a ‘level playing field’ it would expand the foreign markets for American goods. Also, it would discourage American corporations from shipping American jobs abroad.
If people cannot feed their families no wall, no amount of police, no army, certainly, not having the right papers will ever stop them from seeking an opportunity to work!
~;^}>
Although I’m for immigration reform, I don’t know that it is possible to find and deport the large illegal population in the US. Until Mexico faces up to the problem of poverty there, the illegals will continue to find their way into this country. When there is no reason to come here, the illegal border crossings will stop. And that stars with Mexico, and our insistence on Mexico taking care of they’re own. End NAFTA and a lot of the problem will be solved.
We are in fact a nation of immigrants. Unless you are a Native American Indian, join me in heading to the airport or shipping harbor, and returning to the Euopean country of our origin!
So to Lou Dobbs and his ilk, I say STFU you A**Holes!!
I am aginst granting amesty but agree that our immigration laws need to be updated. I am tired of being the solution to the Mexican elite shipping off their problems to our country. The Mexican goverment is controlled by a small group of ultra rich families that suck everything from their people and push the surplus people to the US to send money back to Mexico.
“The Mexican goverment is controlled by a small group of ultra rich families that suck everything from their people and push the surplus people to the US to send money back to Mexico.”
True, but that money wouldn’t be available in the first place if we enforced existing labor laws. If big companies knew they would be busted for hiring illegals, they wouldn’t do it. But, as long as they can get away with paying them less than minimum wage, it’s a great way to save money.
To hear Western agriculturists tell it (particularly orchardists) there won’t be any fruit traveling to a market ANYWHERE if they can’t have their braceros. May as well take down the Federal dams, put the water back in the rivers, and turn off the power and go “home”… and buy all our produce from South America, China and… Mexico! ^..^
The problem is not with our immigration laws, it’s with those American companies that continue to violate them. Start sanctioning businesses that break the laws and you will see a different picture.
As an orchardist I take great umbrage at the comment by John Browne. At least at our small orchard in the NW we pay WELL OVER our state’s minimum wage which is now $8.55/hour. We have had perhaps a dozen Anglos apply to do the work of pruning, thinning and picking the fruit. We’ve been orcharding for 17 years. We do our best to hire local people and also to hire those with proper documents. I don’t know what the big growers do, but we pay well and treat the people who work for us with the respect they are due. Right now I see more fruits and vegetables in the local grocery stores that are imported from all over the world than I do what is grown right here. Stop with the myth that orchardists are the problem.
How about educating people that if they want food they should be willing to pay a fair price to the folks who grow it instead of looking only at the price. We paid a lot more of our wages for food back in the 50s and 60s and 70s than we do now.
I am all for allowing willing workers to work. Get rid of NAFTA and CAFTA and we’d be on our way. First, however, you’ve got to make Americans realize that manual labor is honorable labor and not beneath them.
I agree with Paul Diamond:
1. Make the hiring of undocumented aliens a Class ‘A’ Felony. An employer caught hiring an undocumented worker would be subject to at least 1 year in prison and a minimum fine of $5000 per illegal hire.
2. Renegotiate NAFTA and all current and future free trade agreements (FTA) to include allowing for collective bargaining, worker safety, minimum wage and environmental protections…. it would discourage American corporations from shipping American jobs abroad.
The only problem with these solutions is that both parties in Congress are bought off by big business corporations that want to make money at the expense of not only illegals, but the American people. Congress is afraid to fight the powerful special interest groups that own them, because they will not be re-elected if they do. And they put their own political careers ahead of the interests of their constituents. Until we can get rid of the Lobbyists and the millions of dollars that they pour into the pockets of Congress, these problems will never be solved!
Love Says:
October 24th, 2009 at 12:04 pm
As an orchardist I take great umbrage at the comment by John Browne. At least at our small orchard in the NW we pay WELL OVER our state’s minimum wage which is now $8.55/hour. We have had perhaps a dozen Anglos apply to do the work of pruning, thinning and picking the fruit. We’ve been orcharding for 17 years. We do our best to hire local people and also to hire those with proper documents. I don’t know what the big growers do, but we pay well and treat the people who work for us with the respect they are due. Right now I see more fruits and vegetables in the local grocery stores that are imported from all over the world than I do what is grown right here. Stop with the myth that orchardists are the problem.
How about educating people that if they want food they should be willing to pay a fair price to the folks who grow it instead of looking only at the price. We paid a lot more of our wages for food back in the 50s and 60s and 70s than we do now.
I am all for allowing willing workers to work. Get rid of NAFTA and CAFTA and we’d be on our way. First, however, you’ve got to make Americans realize that manual labor is honorable labor and not beneath them.
[Love Says has my empathy. Shortly after NAFTA passed through Congress–with much arm twisting by newly elected Bill Clinton–Mexico City became the most populous city in the world. The small farmers have been hurt from Canada on down by these ‘trade agreements’. Love Says, you have my empathy, but I still have to feed my family, & lower prices still rule the day since income has been stagnant almost since the time of Reagan. Put a tag on your product & I might pop extra, & I still don’t shop at Wal-Mart.]
Serving in the media, and national media at his level is a public trust. There is a mission for the press at this level, impartial reporting. Keith is a very intelligent and very angry man who lost sight of this fiduciary duty.
Thought I’d share an article from a couple years ago about our local immigrants…
http://www.clevescene.com/cleveland/the-superior-americans/Content?oid=1499193
“I have no complaints about those people,” says a white-haired man in a sailor’s cap, shuffle-stepping up his driveway just a few doors down from La Hispana. The man’s lived in this house for 50 years, back when the neighborhood was all Irish, and the Italians were the outcasts. It was good old Americans who turned this neighborhood to ****, he says. Now Mexicans are revitalizing it.
“I found out one thing about the Mexicans,” says the man. “They’re clean. They clean up their property. They clean up their house. They make it look decent.”
Keep up the GREAT work, Mr. Lou!!!!
It to bad we do not have a secure Border any more/ I am 80 years old and I never been as disappointed with our representatives as I am now.
it is like we don’t have a government any more.
Well said Eules. This is a tragedy in the making, because of our gutless and conniving elected representatives, and also a stupid, ignorant, sentimental and apathetic electorate, fed rubbish and lies by a shockingly treasonous media.
Our southern neighbors have invaded our country. Does anyone remember why we have a border and an immigration quota ? Answer: To protect our society and culture. We are being flooded illegally by a foreign culture. Way beyond the numbers that our immigration laws deem our culture can absorb. This flood of illegal people being “allowed” to stay is a direct threat to our belief that the laws we all live by and demanded of those who wish to live in America is being enforced. (SORRY a fine and learning English does not solve the problem) So many numbers will have children in our country and their numbers of cheating will then vote in their cultural outlook in our democracy to replace our culture and unique American ethic. Our country has never before had many tens of millions of a very different culture invade our country by jumping line at the border of the hundreds of millions world wide who honorably are anxiously waiting their turn. Remember there is the same reason in Mexico to protect Mexico’s national integrity, . . . ONLY Mexicans can purchase homes or land in Mexico. Think about it.
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