Israeli historian Efraim Karsh argues in the New York Times (8/2/10) today that Arabs have lost interest in the Palestinian cause, which apparently is a good thing because that severs “the spurious link between this particular issue and other regional and global problems,” making it a “positive” sign of hope for future Arab/Israeli peace.
But Karsh’s argument has little basis in fact. The opinion piece takes off from his selective interpretation of a recent poll which, as Marc Lynch of Foreign Policy points out, is not at all scientific. Conducted by the Arabic-language news outlet Al Arabiya (National, 7/22/10), the online survey found that (in Karsh’s words) “a staggering 71 percent of the Arabic respondents have no interest in the Palestinian/Israeli peace talks.”
There’s a world of difference between people in the Arab world saying they couldn’t care less about “peace talks” between Israel and the Palestinian Authority and not caring about the Palestinian cause. In fact, it would be surprising if Arabs, both in Palestine and throughout the Arab world, did express hope in the moribund “peace talks” currently ongoing. Since the Israeli/Palestinian “peace process” started in the early 1990s, Palestinians have gotten little in return besides an ever-growing colonization process in the West Bank and East Jerusalem, a separation barrier that annexes illegal Israeli settlements and restricts freedom of movement for Palestinians, and brutal Israeli assaults that have killed many innocent civilians (GRITtv, 7/21/10).
Another wrench is thrown into Karsh’s argument that “many Arabs have apparently grown…apathetic about the Palestinian-Israeli conflict” when one looks at a 2009 poll of Arab public opinion conducted by the University of Maryland and Zogby International. According to the poll, 76 percent of respondents put “the Palestinian issue” as either the “most important” issue or as one of their “top 3 priorities.”
As a recent statement from the United Arab Emirates’ ambassador to the U.S. made clear (War in Context, 7/8/10), contrary to Karsh’s claim that there is no link between the resolution of the conflict and “peace and stability in the Middle East,” Palestine remains a core issue in the Arab world.
That’s the best way to keep a repressive regime in place: find a way to identify the “wrong” people who we need not fear killing because they are so immoral. How immoral you ask? They don’t even care about the peace process!
The poll is to be cheered on because the regional angry mob is disillusioned and they can’t even be bothered to help until they presumably see a new regime, which just by coincidence, happens to be the basis for Israel’s recent terror.
Following message was sent to David Shipley:
Date: 8/4/2010 3:24:44 PM
To: shipley@nytimes.com
Subject: Op Ed – Arab ambivalence towards Palestinians
Dear Mr. Shipley:
We are asking the New York Times to publish a correction pointing out that Efraim Karsh’s August 1 op-Ed about Arab ambivalence towards Palestinians erroneously treated an unscientific website poll as if it were a meaningful survey of public opinion, and misrepresented even its findings.
In light of this, it would be best to correct this misconception.
in advance.
Sincerely yours,
Mary
David Shipley
shipley@nytimes.com
As a social scientist with nearly fifty years of experience in public opinion surveys, I find that Efraim Karsh’s August 1 op-ed about Arab ambivalence towards Palestinians has erroneously treated an unscientific website poll as if it were a meaningful survey of public opinion…and then he misrepresented even the findings of this meaningless survey.
I am asking the New York Times to publish a correction.
Dr. John M. Stewart
Professor Emeritus of Psychology
Northland College
Following message was sent to David Shipley:
To: shipley@nytimes.com
Sent: Wednesday, August 04, 2010 2:54 PM
Subject: Correct the misrepresentation in KARSH op-ed
Dear Mr. Shipley:
Correct that false assertion in Karsh op-ed re poll of Arabs re Palestinians.
Tainted, unsubstantiated news. YES…
“FIT TO PRINT”…..NO.
See to it promptly, and NOT buried in some boondock location of your pages.
Make it bold. Eat crow. Right there on the op-ed page. Own it. Tell the full story.
If the Arabs care so much about the Palestinians why then is it that no Arab countries will accept Palestinian immigrants? The Arabs don’t care a whit about the Palestinians. They only care about using the issue as a wedge issue with the west.
I lived, played, worked, taught in an Arab country for 12 years, spoke with no officials, but everyone ELSE were damned concerned about the Palestinians.
And why should Arab countries relieve pressure on Israel and the US by taking in Palestinians, and what makes you think they WOULD leave, thus fulfiling israeli demands?
…such ignorance and stupidity..
~John L.
Sent an e-mail regarding Efraim Karsh’s misrepresentations to D. Shipley @ the NY Times. It’s NOT ONLY “Arabs” who care about what is happening to the Palestinians. What I HATE absolutely, is how freely
spun webs are distributed so easily all over the world.
More and more people are “becoming immune” to the TOXIC, CRAZY GLUE and are beginning to steer clear from these very destructive, global media “traps”. People Awake.
I live in the USA. I have worked and lived in many other nations (12 years -age 28 to 40). But, I don’t want to be invited to change ‘my USA’. I, much like Palestinians, love the land & nation where I live the (USA). Contrary to what Mr. Rick states, “My experience teaches me that ‘The Arabs of all nations, including our own USA, very much care about the Palestinians’.” Mr. Rick’s “wedge issue” is a “non-sequitur”. Mr. Rick is dead-wrong! The Palestinians have been where they are since 70 A.D., and many centuries prior to 70 A.D.
I wish the poll would have also read”Do you care deeply about the 87% of Palestinian lands now in the hands of Arab countries, and the lack of talks to return any of it.Or do you care more about the constant/ endless talks with the Israelis for that spit of land they now hold and live on, that was once also Palestinian?(This is considered by most the only Palestinian issue).
Here is the second question….Should attacks begin immediately to the same historical level against those Arab countries- as has taken place in the long war against Israel?
Here is the third one….Should Arabs (who do care deeply)attack themselves- for usurping Palestinian lands.
Sorry for the sarcasm.
Anyone who seeks proof of the Arabs’ support and sympathy for the Palestinians received proof after the Israeli raid on Gaza. Arabs were in the streets of Cairo, Beirut, Damascus and elsewhere.–mk
Rick Says (August 6th, 2010 at 7:02 pm): “If the Arabs care so much about the Palestinians why then is it that no Arab countries will accept Palestinian immigrants? The Arabs don’t care a whit about the Palestinians. They only care about using the issue as a wedge issue with the west.”
How about the Israelis quit chasing Palestinians off of their own land in what remains of Palestine and they stop carving up Palestine for a Greater Israel, and while they are at it, why not allow the Palestinians who have been chased from their lands to return to them. If other nations accept them, it would suit Israel just fine in their drive to carve up more land for their own.
I highly recommend that the readers of FAIR check out two publications: “The Israel Lobby and U.S. Foreign Policy” by J.J. Mearsheimer and S.M. Walt and “The Power of Israel in the United States” by James Petra.
When I attend Jewish political meetings, I hear comments like, “Both sides in the Israel-Palestine dispute must make sacrifices to achieve peace.” What sacrifices has Israel made or is Israel willing to make? None so far! Israel has usurped Palestinian ancestral homes, many dating back hundreds of years, and Israel still refuses to honor United Nations Resolution 242 calling for the return of conquered territories from the 1967 War. Even the father of Israel, David Ben Gurion, said he would not accept what Israel has done if he were a Palestinian.
How much longer must the United States be required to enable Israel to deal with Arabs in ways that create advantageous positions for Israel AT THE EXPENSE OF PALESTINIANS? How much longer will the world accept aberrant behavior: Israel’s brutally assaulting relief vessels and murdering nine workers in international waters?
Frank I can tell you how much longer.The day the Palistinian leadership renounces death to Israel as their charter is the day we can start counting forward.Till then honestly…they can blow it out their you know what.Hell will freeze over before Israel will trust them enough to trust them sitting with a knife at Israel’s neck.And you asked what has Israel given?It seems I remember that whenever they gave land it was used to attack them.6000 rockets fired into that small country.Suicide bombings even of school buses.And all that time Israel with the power to destroy their enemies utterly -at their fingertips.Yet they did not.Their enemies would act in a moment if the power was theirs.What have they given?What have they given?
87 % of past Palestinian lands is in the hands of Arabs.What have they given Frank?Where is war being waged against them? The Palestinian issue is a pawn used to attack Israel.That is the agenda.If it is not so- I ask you again.When will war be launched against the Arab countries who hold and will never return the majority of Palistinian lands?
OK, OK, OK, michael e obviously has the real dope, the last word, the highest truth, the most intelligent & informed view. Clearly the Palestinians, the rest of the Arab world, half of Israelis citizens, & the millions who have been paying attention for the last sixty years are just wrong. What happened didn’t happen. So it’s all OK now michael we were just wrong. It must have been my imagination that the strident, irrational, make up any old story, like a bogus survey was another desperate grasping attempt to hold on to the big lie that is Zionism. Thanks to all those who seek to educate themselves!
Ben.What is the big lie that is zionism?Exactly..inform us pleaseYou talk of irrational views.Lets talk about hatred for Jews.Do you fit into that category?Sixty years you say…..Long time for a country to be under constant attack by the Arab world.Many of those same Arabs fought beside the Germans in perfect harmony of thought, that I am sure brought on no tears as the annihilation of Jews progressed.So add ten years on to your sixty.And of course this pre dated the country of Israel.Wanna go back further on this irrational hatred of the jews?We can go back a long way.Or Fast forward….Ach ma needs a job said today 9/11 was overblown.The poster boy for Jew hate.A nut!Just another nut in a long history of nuts.Join the club.
Dear Mr. Shipley
Following the twists and turns of the Palestinian/Israeli political situation is very difficult for those of us who have limited resources. We depend on the authenticity of media reports, especially of noted media like the New York Times. My attitude about prospects for direct peace talks and about hope for progress toward peace in the area was greatly influenced by Karsh’s op-ed article. Now I find his sources were not adequately vetted by the Times, according to “Fairness and Accuracy in Reporting.” Please print, in a significant location of the Times, a correction of the mistakes in Karsh’s article.
Thank you for your attention to this matter.
Rev. Dr. Scott Dow
Augusta, Maine